National Geographic Magazine and State Journal Register Publish Fraudulent Advertisement

I will not even publish the advertisements because they are designed to rip off Senior Citizens, Poor People, and the less educated/intelligent. Let’s just say that the Amish Heater (HeatSurge) and the EdenPure Heater are the biggest rip-offs since FREE GOLD COINS. Deregulated Capitalism produces the acceptance of theft as the normal course of day. Remember the Snake Oil salesmen of the 1930’s. (There Baaaaaack) Well they are back and George Bush thinks they are cute. Yah know, “Only a stupid (make up your own derogative ethnic or class descripter) would buy one of those. Heck they deserve it.”

For the Record. The most efficient use of electricity is to use it to generate work. In other words it is most efficiently used to run pumps and motors. It is not an efficient way to generate heat (or light for that matter)…though that can be a reusable byproduct of the work. To use it purely to generate heat is incredibly wasteful, BUT any Watt used to generate heat can generate something like 500 degrees of heat if used as efficiently as possible. Neither heater listed above is efficient. Resistance heating is the most efficient use of that electricity if a Person must use it that way. Anyone can go to the local hardware store and buy one for 30$$$.

I can understand the State Journal Register ripping people off with its new “advertising is everything” attitude, but the National Geographic? That is atrocious:


   Just Wondering asked the

question; Do the Heat

 Surge Fireless Flame

heaters that the Amish sell

 really work?

Best Answer – Chosen by Asker

The ads (which are all over the country) are very misleading.

1. A coffee maker uses a large amount of electricity for about a minute. It’s true that the so-called “miracle” heater uses less electricity than a coffee maker DURING THAT ONE MINUTE. But you’re going to have the heater running for a lot longer than one minute a day. So it’s going to cost you a lot more to operate than a coffee maker does.

The heater will cost you around 12 cents per hour to operate. The average cost of electricity in the U.S. is 8 cents per 1,000 watts per hour, so 1,500 watts costs 12 cents per hour on average. This is true for ANY 1,500 watt electric heater.

2. The ads say that the heater produces an “amazing” 5,119 BTU (a measure of heat energy), but ALL 1,500 watt electric heaters produce 5,119 BTU. If an electric heater was 100% efficient, it would convert 1,500 watts of electricity into 5,120 BTU of heat. All electric heaters are nearly 100% efficient, and this has been true for decades. The “miracle” heater is no more efficient than any other electric hea



Let me offer my thinking on the edenpure heater as I sit, somewhat cold, in my office trying to decide whether or not to buy one. As I understand this, a quartz infrared heater is good at heating objects rather than the air. This can keep a person relatively warm in a cool room if they stay seated or at least within the arc of the infrared lamp. That makes it relatively more efficient than heating the entire space around them, even if the cost/btu looks unfavorable.

Welcome to the forums marc13.
Did you notice that they don’t give a BTU rating, or a wattage rating? Your assumptions about quartz heaters are correct, but infrared I’m not sure of. I haven’t found much about that type, but do take notice of what some of us have suggested as alternates to this thing. In the sites I visited from other boards, I didn’t see even one post recommending them (any style). The edenpure in EVERY case was concidered to be highly overpriced and very INefficient. JM ( Junkman462 summed it up very well, have a look.


The Edenpure seems to be a hybrid system. It uses an infrared lamp to heat a copper heat-exchanger. That would make it less efficient that using the infrared to heat you directly, but potentially more efficient in heating the entire room, because the infrared is (might be?) more efficient than oil or gas in heating the heat-exchanger.

May I ask where you found this information? I’ve looked all over the place and couldn’t find anything more than the manufacturers *claims. Nothing about copper heat exchanger. 


If the room has relatively high humidity, this effect would be enhanced by the heat carrying capacity of the humidity (I just stepped over the bounds of what I think I understand).

But from what I understand, it doesn’t heat the room, just objects it’s pointed at.


As an investment, the Edenpure also has the advantage of any portable heat source in that it is portable. So I’m still a little skeptical, but still considering it. Like virtually all technologies, but might not be the best for all applications, but it might be the best for some.

At that price, I seriously doubt it. 


I’d appreciate any corrections on my thinking or understanding of thermodynamics. Thanks

Sounds like you have the jist of it, though I WILL bow to MANY others here.

Why would anyone pay 300 – 400$$$ for something you can get for 30$$$. The offending publications say “ITS LEGAL”. The answer is so is Pedophelia if you don’t get caught or 7 years after the event.

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